By David E. Gehlke
After breaking into mainstream rock radio over a decade ago, POP EVIL finds itself in the difficult position of needing to keep up with the music industry that would prefer them to write catchier, pop-oriented tunes rather than what the band truly wants to do, which is crank out heavier material. Frontman and founder Leigh Kakaty and his band have primarily accomplished that on “What Remains”, their new studio foray, a ten-song romp that channels the band’s penchant for big, radio-ready choruses and even some metalcore-inspired breakdowns, including the stray death metal growl.
Eight studio albums in and with a handful of chart-notching tunes under their belt, Kakaty is determined to keep POP EVIL in the good graces of the modern rock scene while trying to appeal to a broader range of fans who occasionally explore more metallic territory. When he caught up with BLABBERMOUTH.NET, the frontman was eager to share why it was necessary for POP EVIL to go in a more metallic direction and how some of his recent personal challenges have helped propel the band forward.
Blabbermouth: What prompted the heavier, more full-blown approach this time around on “What Remains”?
Leigh: “It’s full-blown; you’re right. Being a radio band, when we came up, I don’t want to say we were pushed away from it, but we were new, we were young, and then we started having success. Looking back, our third album, ‘Onyx’, was our heaviest at that point. We had three number ones by then. After that, my dad had passed away. I was really angry. I was in such a dark place. After the success of that record, I wanted things a little lighter and more fun. Songs like ‘Footsteps’ were written, as was ‘Legendary’. ‘Footsteps’ was an exciting but confusing time. It blew up so big for us. Our ‘alt’ influence took over for a minute. It was lighter. It was where my head was at. Depending on the producers and the band members, it was like, ‘Are we going to write heavy material? I don’t know if my guys want to do it or play it.’ We weren’t as cohesively tight behind the scenes at the time. We were going with the motions. When you’re in this, and you’re young and having success, your priorities change. We were gone away from our families. Suddenly, with the success, we’re not gone for months and months, we’re gone for years. All this stuff starts to brew up. The anger starts to come again, and that’s when you see the influence. Look, it’s time to get back to our metal roots. POP EVIL was the name for a reason. We have our melodic side, but we’re very influenced by hard rock and metal music. In the early days, we weren’t pushed for that. Streaming was different. Even if we had a heavy song, it wouldn’t have been played. There was no place for it on streaming. Then when ‘Waking Minds’ hit and we had success, it was like, ‘Our fans want it.’ The fans were like, ‘When are you going to get heavy again? We really love ‘Onyx’.’ We started to listen. Then it was a journey to find the right producer to get it out of me and the band. Drew [Falk] was certainly the guy for that. Then, the pandemic happened, and the anger and frustration took over. Then there were band member changes. What led out of the chaos was a group of guys coming together that understood the heartaches we had to get here. When the DEVOUR THE DAY guys came here [Joey ‘Chicago’ Walser, bass and Blake Allison, guitar], it was great to have five guys on the same page to embrace the heavy sound. They were supporting me off the stage in a way I hadn’t experienced before. I was able to be more open to doing what I wanted to do in the studio. Once the band heard where my creativity was going, they said, ‘We’re all about this. You need to explore this therapy and write this music.’ Once I had that support, the doors opened. It was like, ‘Where can we take this band?’ It was a re-branding, a fresh start for the band. We feel like the best songs for POP EVIL have yet to be written. That was the mindset when this album was in the early stages. We ran with it. The exciting thing was that we still put the brakes on it. I wasn’t ready to be done with the writing process, but management and the label said, ‘This album is awesome. We’re ready.’ I still wanted to search with the producers and the band. I wanted to write more with Joey and Blake and push the heavier sound and where we can take it. I’ve never been able to push those boundaries. It’s been a fresh start for me, and I have fun again like I was when I was a kid and want to be in this business.”
Blabbermouth: That being said, and taking into account some of the success you’ve had on the radio, do you feel like this is the right lane for POP EVIL now?
Leigh: “It’s been 20 years and eight albums to find ourselves. When we came into the scene, the money dried up. We weren’t allowed to go into the studio and find ourselves. We recorded ten songs. If it didn’t sound like POP EVIL, who cares? It had to go onto the record. We had to evolve. Sometimes, success can make things a little tougher than easier. ‘Footsteps’ is a great example. It’s our biggest song, one of the biggest songs we play. We grew up in the test market that is Western Michigan. If you look at my skin tone, I wasn’t all white; I wasn’t all black. I was right in between. I’m a mix of Canadian and Indian roots. Where’s the role model that looks like me? Not many of them. Where do I find my place? During my journey, I was doing all kinds of music. I grew up on the Great Lakes. We would take our acoustic guitars on the weekend, and we’d all pass it around the fire. Everyone would play a song or ballad, and everyone would sing along. That was the scene for me. I have always had a passion for an acoustic and a ballad vibe, but during the day, you want to throw down, like METALLICA and PANTERA. On the weekends or at night, we listened to PEARL JAM and STONE TEMPLE PILOTS. There was such a variety of music being thrown at me. It was inevitable that so many different styles would influence me. Now, leading up to this eighth album, maybe it’s the early tour with JUDAS PRIEST or FIVE FINGER DEATH PUNCH. There’s always been this metal fanbase that has followed us. They’re always angry that the albums aren’t angrier. We’re going for the jugular and reminding people we’re here and not happy staying in one place with the success we’ve had. We’re taking the success we’ve had and throwing it away. We’re going to embrace it and respect it, but at the same time, we’re not going to stand still. We’re not going to go off into the sunset playing the hit songs. Maybe, for the first time in a long time, we’re on the right path to where we want to take the band.”
Blabbermouth: Well, it would have been easier to go lighter. Surely, people are talking in your ear to go in that direction.
Leigh: “We’re writing music for other people. It’s not just me. That can be challenging. The selfish side of me can go, ‘I want to write that kind of song.’ I can speak for the five of us: We are ready to push boundaries and see where we can take the band for the first time. It deals with how we get along with each other. We get it. We’ve experimented with things that haven’t worked, and we’ve done things that have worked. It’s time to push it. It speaks to where I want to take my vocals. You hear a lot on this album where it’s not, ‘Put a little reverb on my vocals and ride off.’ I want to make sure the textures from the effects that we can use from the programs and software are more advanced. Let’s utilize it. Let’s be kids again and play with that technology, but at the same time, give them the patented sound people know and love from POP EVIL. Or give you plenty of stuff that’s different, especially for the old-school fans. As those songs become your property, you start to realize, ‘Hey, I like this album. Maybe more than any other POP EVIL album.’ It allows us to keep going. If you are one of the fans who likes our old stuff, that stuff is still there. The band needs to evolve and get younger people to come out so we can keep having a career. We’re looking at what the younger bands are doing, like Cody [Quistad] from WAGE WAR, picking his brain and diving in and having the conversations about how he loved the old-school POP EVIL and talk about how we can change it and tee it up for the future and get a new generation of fans onboard for the first time. It was an exciting time, but we feel like we’ve tipped the iceberg when we get ready for the next record.”
Blabbermouth: Is it wrong to say, then, that you’ve previously had people telling you what to do?
Leigh: “Yes and no. The pressure, for sure. When you’re the frontman and leader of the project, there are a lot of people counting on me. The Covid became a thing where it’s less about what I want and more about the band. Let’s dive in. Like, ‘Let’s point fingers at each other so we can be better.’ Or, it could be about substances and telling each other, ‘Put the bottle down. Take your selfishness and put it aside. Let’s come together as a five-piece, a band of brothers. Worst-case scenario, go for it.’ Not having those distractions to be used as excuses. Like, go for the jugular, and if it doesn’t work out, I can live with that. When you start doing those things, people are inspired in a totally different way. The amount of love and excitement we’ve had over this album has been great. We’ve had people excited about our records for sure. It’s a different time. It feels like an awakening for our heavier side. It’s what people wanted for a long time. To be able to tap into that and give them music we are excited about is really exciting for us. It was an evolution. It took songs like ‘Waking Lions’, ‘Breathe Again’ and ‘Eye Of The Storm’ to create an identity. It’s something we lacked. We had great songs, but it was up here, down there, and we were taking people on this roller coaster ride, which made it hard for them to focus on supporting us or being gung-ho.”
Blabbermouth: You’ve been in the band since the beginning. Can you delve into how much pressure falls onto your shoulders with all of the things you’re talking about?
Leigh: “With POP EVIL, it’s been an evolution. People come and go. Unfortunately, it’s like ‘Wishful Thinking’. In the beginning, you wish we were going to take on the world together and stay one big happy family; then, the music business hits you in the face. You realize it’s not 50/50/50/50/50. If I’m writing a song and I wrote it, I want respect for it. Writing is different than being in a band. Sometimes, people don’t agree on it. If I’m in the room with you and we wrote a song like ‘Footsteps’, how can anyone else say we didn’t? We did it. Sometimes, it doesn’t take five people sitting in chairs to go ‘Kumbaya’; it doesn’t work that way. I always relate it to Applebee’s. If you’re going to cook at Applebee’s, at least I should get respect for my time. If I’m going to be away from my family and friends, I want respect for it. I wore a lot of those dark times on my sleeve. It was hard early on in my career. Somewhere in there is a responsibility. You want to be great. You want to push the other guys. When the other band members are partying or doing the things that are taking them away from the benefit of the group, it can be tough. I understand. When you’re touring for 200-plus days out of the year, it’s hard to find an opportunity for yourself to get away and find your sanity. For me, I struggled with a lot of issues. You saw moments of it where I thought, ‘Do I want to do it?’ You always have those questions. ‘Are people listening? Does it matter?’ Then that song will be written: ‘Waking Lions’, ‘Breathe Again’. Then it’s like, ‘Yeah, this is what I need to be doing. I love this.’ Then, Covid happens, and you realize, front and center, if you didn’t want to be doing it, you were out of it. If you really wanted it, not for the fame or money, but because you were really a musician or touring junkie, you stayed, and you stayed because you loved it. I loved everything. I realized everything up to and including the Wal-Mart bus stops; I loved all of it. I promised myself I was going to come back with a clearer mindset and wear responsibility differently. I didn’t know until I wrote ‘What Remains’. I was writing about ‘We,’ ‘Us,’ ‘Gathering’ and ‘We’re legendary’, inspiring songs for other people. Suddenly, I had to come out for me to move forward. I had to write, ‘I am what remains.’ ‘I am on my death walk.’ ‘I am wishful thinking.’ The mindset changed. I need to talk about myself to be a better frontman on the stage, get that stuff over with and try to heal with it. Once I had the band’s support, they said, ‘Wow, you need to keep going.'”
Blabbermouth: Do you want to go into “Knife For The Butcher”? It’s easily the most experimental song on “What Remains”.
Leigh: “I’m always writing. I’m not always writing for POP EVIL, but then I take things and run with it. That song is experimental. I always feel like POP EVIL tries to do at least one different song. It reminds me of ‘Work’. ‘Knife For The Butcher’ is about how we always fall in line, and the people who are there to protect us are there to butcher us. It seemed to fit with what I was dealing with, especially in this business. They’re the first to lift you, then will bring you down, especially when you’re trying to send positive messages through the world with your music; people are there to cut you down. It’s a bit of a yin and yang when you’re in the business. Here, you have a mindset when you’re trying to come together at a time when people are more separated than ever. You have to have thick skin. You need to get to a space where you can see things and take it with a grain of salt.”
Source: blabbermouth.net
