THE WILDHEARTS' GINGER Is Back From The Brink And Has No Love For The 1990s: 'I Thought It Was F***ing Rubbish'

By David E. Gehlke

The man born David Walls but better known as Ginger Wildheart has a few stories in him — just don’t prod him about the decade when he became famous. His eponymous THE WILDHEARTS‘s 1993 “Earth Vs. The Wildhearts” debut immediately put the U.K. rockers on the map for its uproarious blend of rock, punk and alternative — with a decidedly anthemic edge. Kerrang! magazine got onboard and named it as their choice for the best album of 1993, an honor that should have been part of the band’s rocket ride to the upper echelons of rock. Then, as the tale goes, drugs, alcohol and Britpop got in the way, leaving THE WILDHEARTS to limp through the following years until Ginger pulled the plug in 1997.

The band reformed in 2001 and has since been through a variety of breakups and makeups that have coincided with Ginger‘s well-publicized mental health issues. After hitting what is arguably his lowest point in 2023, Ginger has picked himself up off the mat and reassembled THE WILDHEARTS with a new cast of characters. The resultant “Satanic Rites Of The Wildhearts” is viewed by some (including the band) as a contemporary to “Earth Vs. The Wildhearts”, which is an apt description. More importantly, Ginger is in a much better spot living in the North of England, something that was evident when he got on the line with BLABBERMOUTH.NET.

Blabbermouth: This album is about turning a negative into a positive. Can you share some backstory?

Ginger: “I just got out of the hospital. I was placed in a hospital section, which is the best thing for you and everyone else — to step away for a couple of weeks. After I left the hospital, I had no interest in music whatsoever. I knew I had to turn my life around. The first song came, and literally the second, third, fourth — everything came rolling out of nowhere. There was a point when I realized I needed to make changes in my life, moving to the countryside being one of them. Throughout the process of writing the album, I understood how much control I have over my emotions, my anger and my mental health. It’s not something you usually hear about when you’re in the system, where they’re focused on making money for the drug companies and for the therapists to buy new cars. There aren’t many self-explanatory methods. How you feel determines everything. How you see the world determines everything. The energy you project determines everything. I know because I’ve been in a very negative, extreme kind of place where many bad things happen all the time. Since I moved out here, everything seems to be going great. The album marked the beginning of my realization that it’s up to me. I can’t rely on the mental health system, my friends changing anytime soon, or society developing a conscience. I just figured it was up to me. The album starts very negatively and ends on a positive note.”

Blabbermouth: It looked like 2023 was simply a rough year for you. Is this record the result of coming out of it?

Ginger: “Absolutely. I find music to be cathartic anyway. This one was a bit more personal since I was writing during a time of change. The changes were reflected in the songs. I learned things about myself, especially about my spiritual side — things I’ve ignored and numbed with alcohol and drugs over the years. I’m not an angel, and I’m not part of the sober brigade, but I don’t do hangovers anymore. I don’t want to be drunk, and I don’t want to numb myself to what life has to offer. Your energy changes everything. Not everyone picks up on your energy, but people will notice when you’re looking good. I lost a lot of weight. I went away. I’m a lazy motherfucker, like most humans and pretty much all musicians. I didn’t want to work on myself. I didn’t want to work on my body. I didn’t want to lift weights. I realized that if I don’t, I’m not getting anywhere. I’ve got this overweight drinker’s body that I’m stuck with. I decided to do something every day, which has been good since I’ve gotten fit.”

Blabbermouth: Along those lines, was there just too much negative energy with the classic WILDHEARTS lineup?

Ginger: “Oh my god. The last lineup ended so poorly. We thought, ‘Let’s get the original band back together,’ like reuniting with your ex because the sex was good. For 90 minutes a day, it was fantastic. We got on stage, and it was amazing. But as people, we had nothing in common. If we had split the writing equally, it might have worked, like with the ROLLING STONES or GUNS N’ ROSES. I was still writing all the songs. It was nothing but negativity. The end was brutal. While working on these songs, demoing them, and having a record deal on the line, I experienced an ‘imposter syndrome’ attack. I asked the guys if they wanted to do it, but they didn’t. It was perfect for me because it brought closure. I never thought about not continuing. We represent almost three generations. THE WILDHEARTS goes deeper and larger than just me, an album, or a band lineup. These are people who have grown with the band and continue to move with it. It would be the cruelest trick to tell me, ‘There are no more WILDHEARTS albums or gigs. You can just go away.’ That’s not in my nature. I’ve invested a lot in this, and they have too. It shows no signs of slowing down. It’s a really interesting story, and it’s not even halfway through.”

Blabbermouth: Bands often talk about that “gang mentality.” Was it ever like that for you guys?

Ginger: “It was never a gang. I wanted it to be, but some people were close in the band and there are those who were never close. The bass player, Danny [McCormack], and I were tight because we scored drugs together. That kind of experience bonds you like brothers. But once you start growing up — when I went and had kids, and he didn’t — that changes everything. When we were young, it was all fun and games as long as the drinks and drugs kept showing up. You get a bit older, and it’s just not the same game anymore.”

Blabbermouth: Is it okay to view “Satanic Rites” as a companion to “Earth Vs. The Wildhearts”? It feels that way.

Ginger: “People have been telling me that. I think it’s because there was an excitement in the studio due to the new energy and fresh faces. Working on the first album was a new experience for me; it was my very first album. There was a certain naiveté to it, like anything goes. That feeling was the same for this one. There have been albums where it felt like pushing a large boulder up a hill. This one was so easy and smooth to create. The studio vibe felt similar. It’s just a collection of songs to me. It’s another collection of songs, but I understand why people say it has a similar feel. The record is intended to capture a similar vibe in the cover and the title.”

Blabbermouth: What did they do to you for the cover? What’s on your face?

Ginger: “For the first album, I couldn’t get anyone else to do it, so I had to do it myself. I wrapped my face in barbed wire and lay in a bath of black oil. I had huge insects crawling over my face to depict what I thought was the most uncomfortable a person could feel, and then I put it on the cover. I thought I nailed it, but I was nowhere close. I nailed it the last time. The guy who runs the record company, Dante Bonutto, and I have been in the business for so long. We’ve had a lot of experiences. We couldn’t design a cover like this using computer graphics. We were like, ‘We’re old school. Let’s create a memory. Let’s make an experience out of this.’ On the hottest day of the year last year, there was a heat wave. Even during the best of times, you could barely go outside because it was so hot. I had frostbite. I was getting in and out of this pool filled with ice-cold milk. In and out. Get more makeup. In and out. That was the thing that messed me up. I had frostbite — my lips were blue in the picture. We out-discomforted the first album. It fits with my ridiculous logic.”

Blabbermouth: You were suffering for your art.

Ginger: “There are two ways of doing it: Hardcore. Or in the box.”

Blabbermouth: Is the song “Kunts” about anyone in particular?

Ginger: “Yeah, it’s about people who annoy you. That was the vibe in the studio. Everyone was contributing ideas. I’m not really used to that in this band. It was great having everyone contribute. We came up with the idea for this song, which is to write down what annoys us about people. It made the process so much fun. We were like, ‘Really? Does the bag on the seat annoy you?’ Also, ‘Cyclists annoy you?’ That’s going in as well. I think mine was traffic wardens, you know, the ones who give parking tickets. That’s a rough job. We only had so much time for the song, so we might do another one with more people sharing their thoughts on things they hate, specifically those things that annoy them about people.”

Blabbermouth: Where did the title “Hurt People Hurt People” come from?

Ginger: “It’s about when people place false hopes in the mental health system, only to have it let them down, leaving them with nothing. The song reflects the moment you realize there’s no hope in the system; it won’t fix you. Your only hope comes from taking action yourself. You need to find your own survival instincts and coping mechanisms. That’s the essence of the song. You can’t go through life carrying the burdens of the past and expect to make progress. The song conveys the message, ‘Forget the past; there’s nothing good in it. Forget the future; it only brings anxiety. Focus on the present and start healing yourself. You’re your only hope.’ The title was inspired by my daughter, who is gender fluid and doing really well in music. I referred to her as my daughter in a social media update, and all these people attacked me. I want her to pursue whatever she wants to do, and she’s happy. She gave me the title: ‘Hurt People Hurt People’. It stayed in my mind for months before the song came together.”

Blabbermouth: How important have your children been during all of this?

Ginger: “I’d like to say there’s a reason why you do this, but that’s not true. There are times when it’s dark, and again, I’m not going to go through it many more times. Having learned a few things, the thing about depression that people misunderstand—and I hate the word ‘depression’ because everyone says, ‘I don’t want to know about this’—is that it’s not just sadness. Sadness is part of it, but depression is a divorce from everything: your feelings, your emotions and your love. You can’t feel love; you can’t feel joy. You don’t feel love for anyone, even your kids, when you’re going through it. It’s a debilitating thing. That’s what kills people: the exhaustion of dealing with this separation. On a good day, I’d like to say those are the reasons why I strive to be a better person. On a bad day, like everything else, it fades away. There’s nothing there. It’s darkness. But it’s a good thing to work on.”

Blabbermouth: You’ve already played some anniversary shows for “Earth Vs. The Wildhearts”. Now that you’ve done it and moved past the original lineup, how does that era sit with you now?

Ginger: “I honestly don’t think about it. It sounds like easy glib, if anything. I don’t have any value for the past at all. I can answer questions if something pops into my head. The idea of feeling anything about it is dead. The past is dead. A lot of good things happened. A lot of the time, I was too fucked up to appreciate what happened. The whole thing is a pointless exercise to reconcile with the past. To learn lessons from it and bring it forward to the present. Yeah, I’m all for it.”

Blabbermouth: That’s an interesting take. A lot of musicians tend to romanticize their early years.

Ginger: “It was fucking awful. It was a nightmare. The ’90s were shit. I don’t know why people get a hard-on for the ’90s. I thought it was fucking rubbish. Yeah, there were a few good things. In England, once Britpop hit, everything was over. They were signing OASIS bands. They were signing OASIS cover bands who were getting into the charts. It was pointless, ridiculous times. I guess that’s why we stayed inside of a drug cocoon. It was effective. I don’t remember much of those years. But it was awful. Rock magazines were changing into Britpop magazines. Everyone was into dance music, so that was the new thing that lasted forever. All these guitar players were selling their guitars and buying samplers. ‘Electric guitar is over.’ I’ve heard this argument so many times in my years. Unless you invent something like the guitar, it’s still cool. Keyboards are not as cool as the guitar. Guitar, cars, horror movies, going out on a fucking weekend. They’re classics. They’re not going to do better than that. The ’90s were a bunch of bullshit. People think they know the future. It didn’t mean anything to me.”